Rockwell and siemens PLC communication via ethernet

Hello,
I want to communicate controllogix PLC 1769-L33ER with S7413-3PN/DP using there elthernet connection.
So how we can do this? Is any devices like prosoft or any echochange module is required? Or using some standard communication library blocks, this data exchange will be possible.

Kindly guide me for this.
Thanks.

Hello:
If a machine builder does not have access to the PLC programs an off-the-shelf solution such as Prosoft or echochange may be required. But there are ways to do this since both Siemens and Rockwell support Mobdus TCP protocol.
For example, the link below gives you very well documented AOPs (add-on profiles) for Rockwell so it can behave as a Modbus TCP client or Modbus TCP server. Let's say you decide the Rockwell application will be a Modbus TCP server. Then you would need to find the way to implement Modbus TCP client on the Siemens side, for which you can find extensive documentation on Siemens resources.

https://www.rockwellautomation.com/...-6a73-7837-c938b10af88e;deepLinking=undefined

Hello, Thanks for the reply. But I want to do it on ethernet. Siemens plc will be the master.

simaran2010 said:

Hello, Thanks for the reply. But I want to do it on ethernet. Siemens plc will be the master.

Click to expand...

Modbus TCP "is" an Ethernet based protocol. It is different from Modbus RTU which is over serial link.
So you can use the Siemens PLC and a modbus TCP client (master) and the Rockwell as the Modbus TCP server (or slave).

Siemens has a coded function to communicate with Logix controllers through ethernet. I believe it implements the CIP protocol.

However, I think you need to ask them for it.

cardosocea, this is even more straightforward than using Modbus TCP. Thanks for the heads-up.

There are some links in the Siemens site:
https://support.industry.siemens.com/cs/document/109782317/cip-client-%E2%80%93-exchanging-process-data-with-third-party-control-systems?dti=0&lc=en-CH

AlfredoQuintero said:

cardosocea, this is even more straightforward than using Modbus TCP. Thanks for the heads-up.

Click to expand...

No problem. They made me aware of this when I was converting a plant from Rockwell to Siemens controllers and needed to have them all talk to each other.

The function worked a treat then but it wasn't made available to anyone.

This kind of thing is also one of the many reasons I despise Rockwell... had they bothered, access to something like this would be charged at 5k or something more ridiculous than that.

Sorry for the rant.

What is this CIPService tool which is also available in the download links?


OK, I see what it is. Still a work in progress.

I agree with you. Siemens must have realized the value that this set of libraries and tools have for their customers, that they give this for free. Interesting.
https://support.industry.siemens.com/cs/document/109782317/cip-client-%E2%80%93-exchanging-process-data-with-third-party-control-systems?dti=0&lc=en-CH

ok. CIP protocol blocks and settings can works in simatic manager?.

Is there any possibilities of converting RSlogix 500 plc logic into step7?

AlfredoQuintero said:

I agree with you. Siemens must have realized the value that this set of libraries and tools have for their customers, that they give this for free. Interesting.

Click to expand...

They'll give you a lot more for free to leave other brands for their own, you just need to ask.

simaran2010 said:

ok. CIP protocol blocks and settings can works in simatic manager?.

Is there any possibilities of converting RSlogix 500 plc logic into step7?

Click to expand...

Yes.

https://new.siemens.com/us/en/produ...-easy/resources/code-conversion-services.html

This is free, by the way.

Or see this to do it yourself:

https://support.industry.siemens.com/forum/WW/en/posts/siemens-migration-studio/152071

simaran2010 said:

Is there any possibilities of converting RSlogix 500 plc logic into step7?

Click to expand...

cardosocea said:

https://new.siemens.com/us/en/produ...-easy/resources/code-conversion-services.html

This is free, by the way.

Click to expand...

They write that "This service converts your legacy controller and/or HMI Panel code to:[..]"
I think that this free conversion service is only for Siemens legacy controllers, i.e from S5 or S7-300/400 to S7-1500. Or from Protool or WinCC Flexible to TIA WinCC. It is not for example from RSLogix 500 to TIA. Blows my mind if they would actually convert from non-Siemens controllers, AND do it for free (!??).

Even when it is only from legacy Siemens, I find it surprising they will do this for free.
It can be quite involved to convert from old system to a current one.
Do they 'only' run the old project through the automated converters, or do they also do such things as select the best hardware fit, when there is no direct replacement. And do they check up on the automatically converted code and manually touch up the parts that wont convert 100% ?

JesperMP said:

Even when it is only from legacy Siemens, I find it surprising they will do this for free.
It can be quite involved to convert from old system to a current one.
Do they 'only' run the old project through the automated converters, or do they also do such things as select the best hardware fit, when there is no direct replacement. And do they check up on the automatically converted code and manually touch up the parts that wont convert 100% ?

Click to expand...

I was converting PLC5 to S7-1500 and they ran the project through a converter software that recreated the exact same structure of the PLC5 program and DB's to recreate the N, F, B and T files. It had loads of errors that you'd then have to manually sort out like PIDs and Timers I believe, but it was fairly easy to do since it directed you to the problems.

However, and even Siemens mentions this, the result of the converter is a starting point and should have a lot more work put into it to make it usable for humans further down the line. I was overruled by the local neckbeard where I was working and the resulting project was horrid to troubleshoot and read and didn't make use of PLC features because it "had to be the straight conversion and nothing changed!!!"

This was a mistake and I'm of the opinion that a re-write pays itself in simplicity (by removing dead code) and also the re-discovery of the system. No one knows for sure exactly what these to-be converted systems do and having it re-written is an opportunity to go back on all the conditions and re-assess and document them.

Edit: It's not free... it's the Gillette business model. That one conversion netted me a spare PLC with one of each cards and a fully licensed field PG from Siemens...

cardosocea said:

This was a mistake and I'm of the opinion that a re-write pays itself in simplicity (by removing dead code) and also the re-discovery of the system. No one knows for sure exactly what these to-be converted systems do and having it re-written is an opportunity to go back on all the conditions and re-assess and document them.

Click to expand...

+100 !

I have done a couple of upgrades, and every time it was a complete rewrite using the latest concepts, libraries, templates etc.
At the same time ancient concepts such as a huge lamp mimic and a bajillion of buttons were removed, resulting in a better user experience, better diagnostics, logging, etc.

The only thing the old PLC program was used for was to clarify the function of some sensor or actuator when it was otherwise not clear from the old documentation.

After such a re-write you have a program that can be maintained.
A blindly converted ancient program takes so much effort to understand that you often decide to not add improvements that would otherwise be trivial to implement.

JesperMP said:

I think that this free conversion service is only for Siemens legacy controllers, i.e from S5 or S7-300/400 to S7-1500. Or from Protool or WinCC Flexible to TIA WinCC. It is not for example from RSLogix 500 to TIA.

Click to expand...

Yes, it actually is rockwell controllers! Wild, right? Legacy Siemens can already be upgraded via migration wizards in Step 7 (S5 to simatic manager or Simatic manager to Portal or 300 to 1500)



From the further down the site:

• Your controller code file in the format as specified in the instructions below
  Instructions for exporting from RSLogix 5 - used for configuring PLC5 controllers
  Instructions for exporting from RSLogix 500 - used for configuring SLC controllers
  Instructions for exporting from RSLogix 5000 - used for configuring controllers
• Your HMI Panel code file - FT View Studio ME archive project file in at least v.6.10 or higher

JesperMP said:

It can be quite involved to convert from old system to a current one.
Do they 'only' run the old project through the automated converters, or do they also do such things as select the best hardware fit, when there is no direct replacement. And do they check up on the automatically converted code and manually touch up the parts that wont convert 100% ?

Click to expand...

It is pretty much only an automatic conversion service, but i'm sure they'd be more than happy to recommend a partner to get it the rest of the way. There's a lot of stuff that doesn't come across, though, like HW/system commands. Things like a GSV get a placeholder in the code, and a Siemens engineer will walk you through what still needs to be done to get it usable. You don't end up with best practices code, you end up with a 1500 pretending it's a SLC500, which is hilariously awkward to use.


Yeah, 9 times out of 10, the end user is better off doing a rewrite from scratch in the new system, but that (usually) costs more, so yeah, we know what that means...

I have always been against these migration tools. It's like having a horse and buggy and replacing the horse with a truck. So now you have a modern truck towing an ancient buggy. You still have the buggy limations.