OT - Robot Distributor

I was just contacted by Turin Robots, China, wanting me to become their US distributor for their line of robots. (I do have distribution experience) They have 25,000 robots sold worldwide, but none in the USA.


Has any of our international friends here ever worked on Turin robots? Do you have any thoughts or suggestions on them?


I would have an expense of getting a warehouse and have to get and keep a Robotics Engineer on staff, so it will be an investment - but so far seems worth it.


I already have one customer interested in replacing a Panasonic robot they were quoted $110,000 to repair or $200,000 for a new one. A new compatible Turin would be less than $25,000.

Its VERY hard to bring something new to market unless your someone like Automation Direct/Siemens/Rockwell, they can introduce a new PLC/HMI and people will jump on it to see if its any good.

I only have a little clout with trainers, I can introduce a new trainer and some schools will take a chance if they like the concept.

Maybe 5-10 years back an HMI manufacture came to me and wanted us to be their USA sales/distribution, I had them send me a couple... they looked good and they were cheap but because no one really was looking at my site for HMI's (at that time) and no one ever heard of them, I could not even give them away and I think I still have them in storage.

My point you are going to need to spend a LOT of money in advertising and getting the word out there, no one is going to Google them so your not going to get organic traffic so you will need to go against the big boys with deep pockets.

Are they going to help market them? Are you going to go to the shows and present what you have to offer?

Best if luck!
Mark

geniusintraining said:

Are they going to help market them? Are you going to go to the shows and present what you have to offer?

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Mark,


I have a list of sales rep's across the country I know, plus will have in-house salespeople [maybe more like salesperson to start]

By contract I will have to attend shows with at least 3 robots on display, and one running every year.

They do help with marketing and displaying at shows per the agreement, plus they provide free training [in Shanghai] and my Chinese work visa still has 4 years left on it.

So how aggressive are they willing to be on their pricing? I would think if they are willing to be the cheapest (or close to it) for a year or two then start to ramp up the pricing it may work, man it just seems like a lot of work, could pay off big but its definitely an up hill battle.

I have done distribution before and know how aggressive sales has to be, especially for a new to the area brand.


With the list price for their 6 axis robots from $18,000 to $40,000 even if they triple their prices they will still beat the Panasonic's. Plus they have a few models of 4 axis SCARA robots.


Plus the robot mentioned above is a fully equipped welding robot with MIG gun, wire feed and 350A weld power supply along with the robot controller and teach pendant for under $25K

I_Automation said:

I have done distribution before and know how aggressive sales has to be, especially for a new to the area brand.


With the list price for their 6 axis robots from $18,000 to $40,000 even if they triple their prices they will still beat the Panasonic's. Plus they have a few models of 4 axis SCARA robots.


Plus the robot mentioned above is a fully equipped welding robot with MIG gun, wire feed and 350A weld power supply along with the robot controller and teach pendant for under $25K

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Wow. That’s cheap
The quality can’t be that good

I worked on a Chinese textile machine years ago
It looked like I welded it together in my garage

PLC said:

Wow. That’s cheap
The quality can’t be that good

I worked on a Chinese textile machine years ago
It looked like I welded it together in my garage

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My first thoughts were along the same lines.
Can they show reliability after 80,000 hours?

I would also be worried about spare parts, especially now. Another issue is the operator interface and communications. It takes a lot of effort to make a good operator interface. I know. We probably spend 10 times the effort to make a good interface ( RMCTools ) and flexible communications as opposed to the firmware ion the motion controller but if the product isn't easy to use and debug, there will be problems with support.


BTW, we could make a $1K motion controller but after we took out the features necessary things like Ethernet communications, plotting, and support for our interface, it would be impossible to diagnose problems quickly. This leads to more tech support that would soak up the small profits quickly. It would lead to longer startups and or down time.
As it is, the extra features are like insurance. We can be online with people around the world in no time.


I realize you would be only supplying local support but that can still be expensive.

Can they show reliability after 80,000 hours?

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At that is longer than 9 years of continuous operations. Just buy another. I doubt anything mechanical will last that long without lot of maintenance in between. Will your car last that long? Buy two and use one for spare parts and or training at first. I would be more worried about the frustration factor.

PLC said:

Wow. That’s cheap
The quality can’t be that good

I worked on a Chinese textile machine years ago
It looked like I welded it together in my garage

Click to expand...

They list 25,000 robots used worldwide, with a robot history of 40 years. Plus they purchased an Italian robot line and incorporated those and their servo's.



I have worked on machines from China that were 10% the cost of other similar machines and found the quality and life cycle to be just as good. That is why I posted here to see if anyone outside of the USA has experience with them - good or bad.



The only troubles I have had is Chinese to English translated manuals, PLC descriptions & schematics - take their descriptions with a grain of salt and figure out what they really mean.

They would have to compete with another Chinese brand robot, Nachi, which already has an installed base in the USA. I've programmed/commissioned half a dozen or so of these over the years. They are no-bells-whistles robot that gets the job done and are priced on the low side.

My customer, who was a heavy buyer of these, changed their specification a couple of years ago to Fanuc and ABB because Nachi couldn't keep up with servicing; too much down time.

(Nachi is headquartered in Novi)

jstolaruk said:

They are no-bells-whistles robot that gets the job done...

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This line lists the controllers, and the weld controllers of welding robots, have DeviceNet, (2) Ethernet/IP, analog, CAN Open and MEGMEET CAN communications, plus if connected online can be remoted into for troubleshooting, programming and OS updates.



They also require a minimum stock of parts on hand so no downtime will be caused by shipping parts overseas (even all motors and extra controllers)


So far everything looks nice to go with this, but I haven't heard from anyone that has actually worked on them.

Ask if they have a Cobot version yet (Collabrative), very popular right now.

When I mentioned service, it was a lack of service personnel that my customer was referring too. The few Nachi had were only based out of Novi which can be tough to compete with when the big guys have regional service personnel available. But some industries can accept down-times more than a day; it may not be important to specific customers.

(PS: Nachi may have already addressed this problem)

jstolaruk said:

Ask if they have a Cobot version yet (Collabrative), very popular right now.

When I mentioned service, it was a lack of service personnel that my customer was referring too. The few Nachi had were only based out of Novi ...

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Yes, hey have COBOTs, now any robot manufacturer that wants to stay in business better have them.


As far as service, I will have to get agreements in various major cities across the country with service companies, or have servicepeople ready to travel, being in the Detroit area service here would be local.

I saw their post on some FB group few days before, where they were bragging and showing how fast their Cobots are and that just don't adds up. There is speed limitation for Cobots, for very obvious reasons.

I’ve done work in packaging and automotive. I’ve been through Motoman and Fanuc training. I would consider using Denso and ABB.

“The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.”

Not implying that their quality is bad, but even if their cost is 10% upfront, who cares?

The cost of tooling is typically far to the right of the decimal place in per piece product cost.

The availability of training, spares, rapid tech support, etc. is really important. I have a Motoman robot installed 15 years ago that has produced millions of parts. I received a call once to touch up some points after a maintenance guy had screwed it up.

It has been serviced 2 or 3 times by a Motoman factory tech. I think I paid 30k for it originally.

That’s what you’re selling against; I’m the kind of guy you have to convince.